ben a flint a écrit :
pour ceux que ca interesse, le savage connait quelques raté coter soliditer,
il y a eu quelque petoir du genre qui ont carrément exploser, un a terrebonne
et un a rimouski ,si perdre des morceau vous derange pas?? go for it
personellement une arme a chargement par la bouche et la poudre sans fumée sa vas pas ensemble. certain diront pas de probleme c'est safe mais apres avoir vue les degats que sa fait jamais je conseillerais cet arme sauf
si elle est charger avec de la poudre noir ou bien un substitue connue.
les canons des Savages sont testes a 120000 psi pour le ML11 et a 150000psi pour le ML. Lors des tir avec de tres fortes charges. la pression monte a peine a 50000 psi. Peu de manufacturier osent dvoiler leur test parce que certains utilisent des canons fabriquées ailleurs sans en connaitre les limites et d'autre peut etre pour des raisons légales. Le fait que deux fusils Savage ait sauté ne veut pas dire que la solidité de ceux ci soit en cause il faut connaitre les faits avant de tirer des conclusions. Des test ont été faits avec des doubles charges avec des Savages et ceci sans aucun problemes. Les deux raisons majeures pour faire sauter un canon quant tu tire des boulets avec sabot sont canon obstrué ou le boulet pas assis directement sur la charge. Généralement, si ut met une trop forte charge, c'est le sabot qui va ceder. Sur les forums spécialisés pour les acb on apprend beaucoup de l'expérience des autres tant bonnes que mauvaises.
Tu peux lire ceci au sujet de la robustesse du Savage.
Strength and Safety of the Savage
By 1SHOT-1KILL
This new system works very well and is very strong. I demonstrated its strength at the range in front of several naysayer's who said I was going to blow my head off by shooting smokeless powder. They kept saying IF I overcharged by a grain or two, it was going to blow up in my face. I got tired of listening to them and asked them if they were will to put their money were their mouth was. I told the one with the biggest mouth that if he was willing to put $100 on the bench I would over charge the 10ML-II I was shooting. He did and I got my LEE 3.4cc dipper and measured a scoop of Accurate Arms XMP-5744 (45 grains) and dumped it into the muzzle, I then got a second scope and started to trickle in a few grains, but decided what the hay, I dumped all of it into the muzzle, for a double charge (90 grains) of XMP-5744. I then stuffed a 250gr Hornady XTP on it, inserted a 209 primer, brought it my shoulder and fire it down range. They all looked at me like I was crazy or something. I then went on to tell them that I had designed this system for Savage and I knew exactly what it would do and was capable of. I did not take the guys money though, my conscience would not let me.
The current design, is the 10ML-II, that does not require the percussion module. The old design the 10ML, requires the percussion module. Each has its advantages & disadvantages, like the 10ML with the percussion modules is a stronger design meaning during destruction test it easily withstood pressures in the 156,000 psi range without any damage, but Savage has had trouble with the tolerances on the percussion modules on some rifles. The current 10ML-II, is much easier shoot, in that you will not have to worry about the percussion modules being out of tolerance are wearing out of tolerance. The 10ML-II is not quiet as strong as the 10ML, but has easily withstood pressures in the 120,000 psi range. Also the 10ML-II is available in stainless, and in the near future both the blued and stainless with be available with laminated stock and Realtree or Advantage camo stocks.
You can weigh every single powder charge, but I haven't weighed a charge (other than verifying the dipper weights for load data) in over 2.5 years. Instead I've been using the LEE Powder Dipper Set, mainly the 3.1cc, 3.4cc, and 3.7cc dippers exclusively for all loading, on the range and in the field. For example, the 3.4cc LEE Dipper will throw dip a charge of 44.9 grains of XMP-5744, if I weigh the charges I go to 45.0 grains even. I use the LEE Dippers on IMR-4227, H-4227, XMP-5744, VihtaVouri N110, and Lil' Gun. But until you get comfortable shooting smokeless powder in a muzzleloader, then by all means weigh them. Back in 1991, when I shot our prototype the first time with 2400 powder, I have to admit the pucker factor was high, to say the least.
There is a tendency to try and equate this muzzleloader to centerfire rifle loads. Yes, a grain or 2 over charge in a 30/06 can result in a blown primer, ruptured case, ect. That is because, in a centerfire cartridge you have an enclosed combustion chamber where the pressure spikes very quickly and with an over charge sometimes dangerously. But with the 10ML-II , you have a pressure relief valve, the sabot. If the charge is too hot, say in an over charge or even a double charge, the sabot simply blows apart at the base, cause blow by at the sabot and the pressure never builds to a dangerous level. I've demonstrated double charges of XMP-5744 with a 250gr XTP, by firing them from the shoulder. But I don't make this a habit, just done it a couple times.
Note: We don't recommend doing this, but you can see what this gun will stand, and the safety margin it affords.
With the 10ML-II, the sabot is the key to getting great accuracy. The key is to keep them cool. This means keeping the barrel cool. If the barrel heats up, then the sabots will heat up in the barrel. When the sabots, any sabots, get hot they become soft and pliable, and will not stand up to the high velocity and pressure. They will shred fingers off and burn through at the base. Allow 5 minutes or so between shots for the barrel to return to a cool state, then load and shoot. This is the most common mistake that I've found new shooters of the 10ML-II making. They tend to loads and shoot as fast as they can, just like with other muzzleloader using BP, PYRODEX, etc.
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